11/26/2006

In your opinion

Lora. Jayne at 11:38 PM

14comments

14 Comments

at Monday, November 27, 2006  Anonymous said...

hey, ok yea when i read that i thought the same thing you did, but its not what it looks like. my dads bible has over half a page about the interpretation and the translation of the verse. go to First John 1:9 and read that. this verse can easily be mis-interpreted. this is one verse out of so many others that say "if we confess our sins, God is faithful and just to forgive us, and cleanse us of ALL un-righteousness." and plus, how are they defining fall away? Peter cursed and denied Christ three times, yet He forgave him. If you want i could copy off the part in my dads bible about this, that might help for you to see. but now, we are forgiven. What the verse is trying to say is prove that no religious work is good enough to save you. i'd have to show this to you so you can understand it all, but this verse is often used to guilt trip the charasmatic denominations, to think that they can't screw up, and make them look bad when they do. Do not be discouraged, or scared. I'm praying for you, sorry i wish i could show you this whole thing, it'd prob take me over two hours to type the whole thing up. I love you, and i'm praying for you.

 

at Monday, November 27, 2006  Lora. Jayne said...

Good point stef.

Thanks for your opinion.

I still don't know what I think of it. I was just wondering what other people thought of it.

You're right. It's extremelly easy to mis-interpret this verse!

Love you so much! Thanks so much for commenting. You don't know how much it means to me when somebody leaves a comment!

PS: I think I agree with your opinion. It makes a lot of sense to me.

 

at Wednesday, November 29, 2006  £l §tévó said...

Hey, I saw this on facebook first so I posted my comment on there. If you want I can paste it on here instead.

 

at Wednesday, November 29, 2006  Hicam H. Trowzan said...

Hey Lora,

Look up these verses: 1 Peter 1:4 and John 10:28-29. I dunno but they might help.

 

at Wednesday, November 29, 2006  Anonymous said...

hey lor,

i would suggest lookin up the verses the david kiddo suggested. then i wud take stefs advice. i think i agre w/her.

lov u!

 

at Thursday, November 30, 2006  Anonymous said...

Hey Lora,

Check your emails. I replied to this post over a email.

Love you

 

at Thursday, November 30, 2006  £l §tévó said...

Hear's the comment in a more readable form.

We talked about this verse extensively in the college Bible study. This verse describes someone who knows the Truth, who has "tasted of the Holy Spirit" by their interaction with believers, but then refuses to accept that Truth. They are enlightened because they have head knowledge. They have shared the Heavenly gift through others and tasted the goodness of God through those relationships. The impossibility that the author of Hebrews talks about here is not simple impossibility, for nothing is impossible with God. It refers to the fact that the person, if they continuing rejecting the Truth they know in their head, will never repent. In our Bible study we talked about "restore again to repentance" could refer to the person masquerading as a Christian, as in they have repented in of themselves, but never accepted the full Gospel, never acknowledged Jesus as Lord over their life. This verse is not talking about a person who is a true Christian but rather someone who feigns to be one, but all along denies the Truth in their heart. This verse doesn't mean someone who is continuously exposed to the Truth but who still denies it can't come to repentance, but that they won't. And yeah, it is a scary verse. It really highlights the importance of knowing where your heart really is.

 

at Thursday, November 30, 2006  Anonymous said...

the stevo guy perrty much said what i wanted 2 say yet didnt know how 2 form words to it.

id go with that lora. lov u!

 

at Thursday, November 30, 2006  Hicam H. Trowzan said...

I think that that verse meens that it is impossible to lose your salvation. That if we could (lose our salvation) then we wouldn't ever get it back, but we can't (lose our salvation).

 

at Friday, December 01, 2006  Lora. Jayne said...

David: Thanks. Im going to look them up as soon as I can! I guess your right, no one can lose their salvation. I think I just read the verse the wrong way.

Stevo: You have a good way of explaining things better. Thanks. I agree with all you said.

Love you all! Thanks for commenting your thoughts.

 

at Friday, December 01, 2006  Anonymous said...

Hey Lora,
I've been laboring over this verse too, in bible study. I'm still figuring it out for myself. I do know that it's talking about christians though. It says "experienced the good things of Heaven, shared in the Holy Spirit,". What are the good things of heaven? Fellowship with God, which is only possible by being in contact, by "sharing in the Holy Spirit". And when it says "taste", it means something different in the greek than in english. The same greek word is used in Hebrews 2:9 where it says "THat Jesus might taste death for everyone". He didn't just nibble at it, he experienced all of it. So does that mean Christians can lose salvation? First, look at the context. "Therefore he is able, once and forever, to save completely everyone who comes to God through him. He lives forever to plead with God on their behalf." If we were able to lose our salvation, He would have to die again on the cross, which is impossible. THat's what the end of it is saying. But that can't happen because of what 7:25 is saying. If we could lose salvation, than Christianity is just another works based religion because there'd be conditions and ways to not go to heaven. which means we did something to get there in the first place. And the rest of the Bible clearly says we are secure. With 123 verses about salvation, if it was anything other than a permanent deal, it would be a rip off, it would make the bible sound hollow. In Joshua 1:9 God promises "I will never leave you nor forsake you." If this doesnt apply to eternity then what good is it? And, if we die and go to hell, will He be with us? NO, because there is an impassible gap between heaven and hell. So He'll always be with us, which means we'll be with Him when we die-in Heaven. And in Ephesians 6:17 and 1 Thessalonians 5:8, It mentions the confidence of the helmet of salvation. So, if we can't lose salvation, What does "who then turn away from God." mean? I'm not totally sure. If it's literal, we don't have to get scared because He holds us in His hand. We can't get out, because we are his children. And even if a child runs away from his earthly father, he's still His son, whether he wants to be or not. If we look at the context of the chapter, it talks about works: verses 1,7-11. My dad told me that turn away drom God just means not turning your back on him and going the opposite way, just not going the direction we should. Which would be like sinful deeds mentioned in verse 1. And, when it mentions repentance, it doesn't include any hint to salvation. If we've already repented and recieved salvation, and it's talking about works, and repentance refers to relational repentance. I'm not sure on the last part. The whole thing sounds weird to be talking about works. But just know that you can't lose salvation, and that's not what this verse is talking about. the chapter end with a comforting reminder that we can put our hope and confidence in God's promises because He doesn't lie. I don't fully get this verse, but don't let it scare you.

 

at Tuesday, December 05, 2006  Lora. Jayne said...

Hey Taylor,

I like your points. I especially liked the part where you said, "And even if a child runs away from his earthly father, he's still His son, whether he wants to be or not."

I guess you're right. It'd be impossible to lose your salvation because God would have to die on the cross all over again.

Good point.

Love you all! Thanks for commenting your thoughts.

 

at Tuesday, December 05, 2006  Lora. Jayne said...

Hey Taylor,

I like your points. I especially liked the part where you said, "And even if a child runs away from his earthly father, he's still His son, whether he wants to be or not."

I guess you're right. It'd be impossible to lose your salvation because God would have to die on the cross all over again.

Good point.

Love you all! Thanks for commenting your thoughts.

 

at Wednesday, August 22, 2007  Naz said...

Hey Lora, saw your question and wanted to weigh in (215 lbs still) with a comment.

One thing is for sure, if this verse means that you lose your salvation then you could never get it back! "It is IMPOSSIBLE for those who have once been ...to be brought back to repentance..." so if it implies that we lose our salvation we could never get it back.

Our salvation is safe and secure because God gives it as a free gift. John 3:16 is so clear here with “…shall not perish but have everlasting life…” That is a two part promise that if I perish and he takes back eternal life God is a liar!

If something is a free gift and we get it taken from us for whatever reason then there were strings attached and it wasn't free.

You can be sure, it was free. That is what grace really means. You don't merit it in the first place and you cannot loose is by de-meriting it by sin or any other thing.

So what does it mean?

The scripture was talking to Hebrew Christians that were on the verge of going back to Judaism. In one quick moment they could stop all the persecution from their families and friends if they would just go back to the temple and offer some kind of sacrifice. If they would do that everyone would leave them alone and they could keep their Jesus stuff and yet all the social heat for their faith in Christ would be off. In first century Jerusalem, with all the persecution, before the destruction of the temple, that was a huge temptation.

The warning from the biblical writer here was that if they would go that route there would be no turning back. “impossible … to be brought back to repentance...”

You might compare it to someone who once was involved with witchcraft. They get saved and are totally freed from that. Now, if they all the sudden go back to it or are tempted to go back then you might tell them the same kind of warning. “If you go back to witchcraft, you will never get out of it. You will be trapped.”

What Hebrews says it basically that very thing – especially when it came to first century Judaism. In fact the Lord was warning them in this way.

Do you know what? Some of them did go back to worshiping in the temple and they never got out of it. Titus, the Roman General, encircled the city (67 AD) and then killed people indiscriminately after he broke down the walls (70AD). Many of the people who were killed were Christians who had not escaped the city before 67AD. Many Christians did not leave Jerusalem as per the command and prophecy of Hebrews 13:12-14. So when Titus sacked the city they died because of their lack of repentance.

He doesn’t say they would lose their salvation but that they would get so hopelessly mired down in Judaism that they would never find their way back to the truth.

Remember that repentance doesn’t equal Justification. Romans 8:33-39…

Hope that makes sense.

Bret

 

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